Questions on Changing Policing

1. Public consultation seems to fail.  Why is this not being addressed?

2. I want to see crime addressed much more directly by officers equipped to bring results at the time they are needed and in circumstances in which they are protected, physically and mentally from violence and other aggression.  At the same time, the public needs protection from incompetent and rogue officers in a manner that does not provide a means for the crooks to escape justice or leave victims subject to intimidation from either the crooks or the agencies supposed to help.

3. There is a massive problem with false complaints and inaccurate reporting of complaints by all agencies.  This is understood in part, but needs substantial investigation and change.

4. “Complaining against police” is a nightmare and needs to be civilianised properly to protect both officers and public from a fatal nexus of bullying senior managers and politicians and ‘stat juking’.  Complex behavioural issues are involved and ignored or dealt with through stereotyping and victim bullying.

5.  All issues seem to be dealt with by people who are not likely to be victims and live professional lives well away from the problems, yet supported by salaries dependant on the problems.  We are all paying into Legal Aid with almost no chance of receiving any benefit from the system (95% will not qualify) and at substantial risk of being abused by lawyers hired to protect scrote or police and other agencies.

6. What is “criminal” is both dismally defined and over-defined.  98% of “crime” is dealt with through Magistrates’ Courts.  This at least suggests many of the problems are “trivial” and could be dealt with in another way.  I see the same criminals (often pathetic people) “dealt with” yet dumped back where they continue to cause the same problems that are not trivial to victims.

7. What is the ‘profile’ of ‘criminals’ in 6?  Across the road, a private house is rented to a benefit druggie with three kids and a recidivist thieving donkey with perhaps 2000 convictions.  They have ‘weird’ night time visitors.  Round the corner, two social houses have similar occupants.  The faces change a bit (though not much) and there is a clear network of ‘evil poor’ families involved in crime and community killing (we should scrap the term “antisocial”).  Their kids are clearly the next generation and involved in bullying and idiot violence not being addressed on a  systematic basis.  Cops turn up and say it might be better not to make complaints because there will be retribution.  They say this as though we don’t know!  Even decent local kids know.  The criminals are allowed to exert influence on kids.

8. The ‘ways out’ have gone.  Much of this was factory work or ‘running away to sea of the armed forces’.  The very idea now, that a burgeoning private sector solution is possible is a  farce.  So is that of the much touted ‘education’  solution.  We do need a jobs solution, but no one in their right mind would take these people into a private business.  In any case, work is now much more efficient than before and we can produce most of what we really need with much less work – and have to to remain in business under current economic thinking.

9. Laws are made by clowns, so dismal they produce laws that would stop them from committing offences.  ASBOs were the classic, but only one example amongst many.  I shudder at the thought of being caught shoplifting, but the law stops ‘me’ not the donkey across the road, or even a few pretty decent people I’ve found selling smuggled and stolen goods (even drugs).  Think of Blair telling us of his great ASBO and frog-marching drunks to cash machines (he’s an obvious clown-plonker) and then  think of the same clown meeting Bush and taking us into war, pretending he was fit to assess ‘intelligence’.

10.  Cops and other agencies are not serving the public and we need to investigate this, find out why and establish a system that tracks offences and offenders so we can see who they are and what is really happening to them.  If, for instance, the donkey across the road is typical, we are maintaining benefit sponsored crime and its continuance, not stopping it.  We are making victims and unpaid, ill-equipped jailers out of that section of the public these people are dumped into.  Much liberal nonsense about rehabilitation is just that – problem dumping – perhaps similar to leaving old people in hospital beds because the right ‘devolved budget’ won’t take them into the care needed.

11.  We should stop lawyers, judges and over-paid cops and Town Hall worthies making big bucks for failing.  What is more criminal – the squalid, low IQ evil poor raiding shops and businesses, nicking your bike and making you feel you can’t leave your home, blasting music, aggressive foul-language and threats, drugging-up, prostituting their kids – or the overpaid nexus of agency bosses, lawyers, judges and politicians leaving them to repeat over and over every day?  We should stop them claiming to be successful when the problems obviously get worse.

12.  Mad, selfish clowns who state that eviction solutions might lead to people complaining about neighbours because they don’t like them (JUSTICE – a cross party set of selfish, behaviourally incompetent loons).  This kind of ‘thinking’ is typical of the selfish mediocrity of schools and universities produce.  It leaves an intimidatory, violent, noisy few damaging many lives far more seriously than a serious beating and can go on for years.

13.  Bureaucracy is the problem, but we need to see what bureaucracy is and who it benefits, not talk about ‘red-tape’.  Sadly, the bureaucrats are the ones “looking to change things” – what a joke – this is leaving the foxes in charge of the chicken shed.

14.  All the right questions are being evaded.  Idiot “suggestions” like “more Bobbies on the beat” are regurgitated over and over – very safe ground for no change.

15.  Cops and other agencies work largely in secret and are responsible only to a rank system that needs to change.  One possible solution is to package jobs for action with those officers involved responsible to victims’ groups for solution.  This should include not spending resources on the crooks without sanction from such groups.  We should stop people being sent into idiot schemes and prisons.  There should be work solutions under severe discipline, including that discipline that can be exerted by those in the schemes on those who breach the conditions.  ‘Screw up chummy and you screw all your ‘mates”.  Blaring music type stuff and local intimidation should lead straight to jail with no possibility of return to the community affected.  Cops know who these people are and  should have the tools to act, and know they will not be tolerated by communities they don’t help and be replaced.

16.  How much of all this starts in our schools, exclusions, no proper education designed for the non-academic, no jobs and the rest?  What can’t we blame our cops for?  Maybe we have to bring back corporal punishment (I personally hate this, but some kids are out of control and too many adults are remaining child-like on violence).

17.  The aim should be the eradication of community-killing and the production of a CJA able to focus on real crime, much corporate and embedded.  It will be hard work because we will have to accept that most of our society isn’t working and the underlying models have failed.  We almost need ‘martial law’ until we get a system working.  The current one is riddled with incompetence we won’t look in the eye.

18.  One aim should be to make policing a more attractive job for decent people to do – and we should look at removing ‘money-rank’ and ‘rank-abuse’ from the system.

19.  We need thought experiments to break open cop-prejudices of the kind the blogs are full of, without falling into political correctness and recognise there is truth in much of the complaints coppers make, including one of the frustrations.  Cops need to be able to stop rogues in their midst and we all need to be able to complain without being smeared.  There are new technology solutions to this – all being ignored while money is poured into vapid research and stat juking.

20.  At ’20’  the question is why there is no new technology, confidential yet open system for this debate to take place?

PC David Copperfield states  (p.96) ‘Police management is much more about the management of inactivity than is is about reducing crime, the real challenge being to do as little as possible, take as much of the credit for any successes as possible and blame the rest on society … We in the police have enthusiastically embraced the liberal vision of heroin-addicted burglars making good and repaying their debts by tidying up the gardens of their elderly victims … so we stay in the police station and fill in forms and complete our investigations while the junkies don’t turn up to do their weeding’.

He then turns the usual trick of such police writing to a case of in-bred evil poor neighbour disputing to show us how difficult it is dealing with these irrational scum.  Been there, have the T-shirt from 30 years ago.  This crap does go on, as David, Gadget and WPC Bloggs go on and on.  What doesn’t get much attention in these books or police blogs (there are exceptions – Hogday when he feels like – great rants on Complaining About The Police)) is what is happening to ordinary decent people try to do anything.  My experience as a cop and victim has been dire.

Otherwise good cops and the rump of idle fail almost entirely.  They right-off criminal complaints as ‘neighbour disputes’ of the kind the police books are full of.  The agencies involved become more ‘criminal’ than the criminals or loons, and it goes right up the system into PSDs and IPCC.  The HMIC is more ‘aware’ but treats the public as unworthy of its attention.  ‘Remits’ are a massive problem.  I’ve seen police officers (ones I knew as otherwise committed coppers) ignore crimes including assaults on themselves in these circumstances, even acting like cowards.  They will even enter into conspiracies to pervert the course of justice to cover up their failings.  The very ‘evil scum’ they all claim to abhor get protected to the point you’d believe they were police informants.  The problems for complainants are compounded by severe lack of investigation and the attitudes David almost exposes.  All the agencies put complainants in harm’s way.  The system has no idea who is telling the truth and can’t tell a truth-teller from the kind of mad evil scum who are the problem.  The very officers involved pride themselves on being able to ‘see’ who is telling the truth (research demonstrates nearly all of us are hopeless at this), but in fact rely on dire stereotyping of the kind in the books-blogs and don’t have the guts to take the kind of steps Hogday reports on ‘travellers’ (Caravan Utilising Nomadic Thieves).  One or two may try, but these are rare, suggesting widespread problems in the rank and file, not just with liberal worthies and SMTwonkers.  You discover, as a victim, that they try to make you the problem and that elected representatives are as out-to-lunch as they were in the expenses scandal, very much part of the problem.  The complaints systems across the board prevent genuine complaint as there is no independent evidence gathering and much secrecy.  You know you must sound like a nutter as soon as you complain.  Indeed, given the stresses involved, as you property is targeted, false claims you are a paedophile and other made and even local kids start throwing stones at your windows (the perpetrators are networked into this and you are not), noise from domestic violence, music and constant odd visitors  … you do go ‘mad’.  The bullying from agencies is criminal – actually so when cops claim to have been where they could not be (an old copper’s ruse is to claim to be ‘in the vicinity’ when not) and start their own rumour mill.

Plenty of recommendations have been made about how to investigate, but you cannot get these enforced.  I suspect much equipment in use is so bad and incompetently used all it does is point the finger at you for further attacks.  The question Copperfields and Gadgets don’t address is what they would do when the complainants are real, not mad and under massive stress.  And almost no one follows up on complaints of bad police work and the even worse work of Town Hall agencies.  HMIC did in a limited manner (one problem being the agencies control who is listed as a victim).

We could look at these problems from victims’ perspectives, developed through representation and independent investigation (moderated by the victims and their representatives) and we could look at the effects of criminal families in the same way.  The questions on policing arising from such would be very different than the posing done by those able to draw big salaries from evading the issues.  There are massive, unasked questions about who is bearing the costs of our failing police and Town Hall agencies.  Part of the answer is ‘the disabled’ (HMIC).

Look at the costs of fostering – putting a child into care costs between £15K and £50K.  What then are the costs of living next door to druggie-thieving-violent-noise addicts?  One possible solution would be to give a group of neighbours perhaps £100K to deal with such a family, on a sliding scale on proximity?  If we weren’t ill, we’d give a child a home – the creeps who used to live next to us felt as though they invaded our home.  There were 5 of them and all needed either care or to be in prison.  £100K would have been cheaper- so why were we expected to take the hit (we lost much more)?  Decisions throughout the CJS would have been different if this factor had been in the resourcing debate!

If there are 100,000 such families, then £10000000000 (£10 billion) would need to be spent on neighbour victims on compensation and control.  How much do such families already cost in benefits?  If they get £20K a year it’s  £2000000000 (£2 billion).  They could be paid this via the neighbour watch fund, leaving £8 billion to find.  I’m not costing here, just hinting at the extent of the problem.  So what might be available to a ‘neighbour watch’ on what we spend now?  Given we don’t pay such victims for loss of quality of life, property and health, why do we pay compensation to injured police officers and prisoners (etc)?  Clearly such payouts are a privilege, not a right.  A doctor may get £500K for a needle stick injury she may have had some personal neglect in sustaining.  Victims of these scum have no role in their losses or injuries.

We could, of course, think of more realistic compensation, like the costs of moving and upheaval (say £20K plus legal aid costs) and place the burden on the landlord (with possible recovery from police and other agencies).  This would at least give victims representation in any ‘resourcing debates’.  This might well lead to housing placement problems, but so what – when you give a set of these scum a home you take one or more off others.  Unless, of course, you get their policing and ours right and they cease to be a nuisance in the locality you drop them in.

21.  Would you live next door to evil poor?  If yes, then volunteer now as a public service you lovely liberal.  If not, then work out you are selfish scum because you drop them on others and resign.

22. Can we make it a criminal offence for selfish scum to moralise in public about the evil poor, unless they volunteer to have a party wall connection or give up a room to them?

23.  Police and Town Hall agencies should have to maintain an open database on criminal and community killing cases.  This would be to stop false recording, but how could we make it work?  None of these agencies can be trusted with ‘confidentiality’ – they abuse victims through it and this must stop.  But how do we protect the innocent – not forgetting we often condemn them to the malfunctions in secrecy of these agencies?

24.  How do we track an individual case in detail so that we can generate true and useful  reporting in place of “statistics” that serve vested interests and not good practice?

25. How do we encourage good officers to stop bad behaviour by their colleagues?  The IPCC is a disaster, but is a non-bureaucratic answer possible.  Anyone needing to get a feel for how difficult it all is could watch ‘Ghost Squad’ free a LoveFilm.com.  Underneath the gloss, sex and dramatic licence some of the issues are raised in complexity (esp. episode 3).  Cops are not investigated like this, but the issues are real, if lacking in the important one of where we could get the evidence given bad cops from the few very bad to the jobsworths have control over it?  I saw very little criminal corruption by the way, though some.  I’d crash the PSDs and IPCC in favour of an ‘open’ reporting system and trained officers to be drawn from a pool doing normal police work.  I’d crash all Gadget’s HRM and give sergeants and inspectors proper line management discipline back, ‘open’ to public scrutiny.  Somewhere in this we have to accept it is both ludicrous to charge officers at Stockwell and let the brass get away with the lunatic defence of their incompetence and the cover up.  17 members of the public do not not hear ‘stop armed police’, AND no one should have shouted this in such circumstances.  People should have been sacked for the cover-up and attempted damage limitation.  All sides have to give up something in this, so we can get something.

25. How can we stop worthy lawyers making fortunes from public enquiries that are useless and the lying of almost anyone caught up in an enquiry in our public services?  Scrap existing complaints systems and go for open new technology solutions?

26. How can we sensibly target our cops (and other CJS systems) on what is needed by the public, poor kids abused by clowns and so on?  Could we decriminalise drugs and yet put more effort into the problems?  How?

27. Could we decriminalise (yet put more and more effective effort) into a whole wad of petty crime?

28.  Can we criminalise the abuse of the phrase ‘learning lessons’ and actually get on with getting good practice working?  Ban the phrase ‘community solutions’?  At least 80% of the community problem is the networking of the evil poor in intimidation.

29.  Engineering has long benefited from disaster.  They get properly identified and investigated.  Sacking people who have been claiming success when there was mostly disaster would be a start.  ACPO could go, but if we take this seriously we need a new election and all the political parties to stand down until we have a new constitution!

30.  Are we so dumb we really believe its better to have 8 million on benefits (it’s more if you include tax credits), keep importing workers and so on than to organise productive work for all?  The invisible hand of economics is as ‘real’ as any god.

31.  With neighbourhood crime the issue is getting the issue sorted out by response police under a get it right first time system linking police powers and the rest of the system.  It cannot be acceptable to leave the same recidivists and their intimidation networks in place to cause so much trouble.  Disasters in this are commonplace and go on for years.  Proper and tough powers to stop noise, threats and persistent ‘coming to police attention’ need to be put in place and culprits removed from their homes after no more than two or three official warnings – we can lose our jobs for less.

32. Things may be so bad that we need to accept our cops are not the world’s best or anywhere near.  I’m not sure this is the case for the cops but do feel it is true of the rest of our CJS (they ain’t really good anywhere, but much better in most of Northern Europe).  The fact we don’t know much in public debate about other countries’ systems is concerning.  There may be a good model to use as a template here.  I like the Dutch one – but the changes need to be across our systems from schools, through social services and courts.

33.  ‘Human Rights’ organisations and people in this country seem clueless and concerned only with middle-upper class issues and easily get confused about the ‘rights’ of people hurting others.  ‘Rights’ are not good as the basis for much intellectually (nonsense on stilts etc.), but we also forget we can also ground nothing in thought alone and end up in the ultimate selfishness of solipsism where even other people are just part of one’s own consciousness.  It is something like this drivel that prevents apparently competent people from understanding much other than their own perspective – selfish clowns with high IQs.  ‘Balance’ is needed, but again this fails as soon as you watch the BBC trying to be ‘balanced’ and realise they are nearly all arty middle class goons.  None of us can generate all the questions needed and certainly not the answers – but we don’t recognise this half-enough.  We need to recognise Action Man is a plastic doll, but also that the cop with blood on his hands, an unconscious husband and who has just smacked the wife in the mouth may have reasons for the violence (like being attacked with a poker by one and stabbed with a shard of glass by the other whilst trying to protect both) and those who have never been in such situations almost always lack the knowledge to understand – and them remember that cops do use violence wrongly and panic, squirting off rounds because someone else pulls a trigger (Moat?) and putting the adrenaline boot in.  In rugby, you get sent off for the latter and there should be some similar punishment for cops in panic situations.  Instead we end up in lies and cop collusion.

34.  Our CJS needs to ditch “credibility” in evidence giving.  All research demonstrates we are useless at this and need to learn what evidence is and how far it is reasonable to stretch it.  Bent forensics are now with us as well as very intolerant juries, judges and the straw-men lawyers.  We could do a lot better on evidence, but again most of us need to learn we are not good at spotting what it is.  Many case brought to court don’t need to be and there is still heavy bias against defendants and in favour of those who can muster slicksters.  The vast majority of those I’ve seen in Magistrates’ courts are little more than children.  The parental gap could be better closed than through this system.  I would favour pleas for non-criminal restitution and for all other than recidivist convictions to be spent quickly.  At the same time, recidivists should be spotted quickly and tagged until they stop.

35.  Police officers should realise that they are now substantially overpaid and consider what happened to British industry; then ask what it is that is so different about them.  This is true of much of our overpaid public sector and is a substantial reason we have so few factories and work for those we once managed to employ in droves.  We take too much, are too selfish and stuck up ourselves.  The bottom-end, low IQ (yet possibly high skill) economy has been screwed because it was open to foreign competition.  We can’t educate people out of it and need to provide jobs and wealth instead of importing labour and pretending we are ‘better’  – ‘we’ were just less exposed to the competition.  ZanuPFNulabour was wrong to expand the public sector as it did – government should look after minorities and it failed the poor whites totally.  Average cop pay where I live in the castrated North is three times average take home.  That’s thieving too, though hardly Shaggerooney style.  Islam has it that if we don’t sort a fair society there can be no crime.  Not everything is rubbish from any source.  You cops take too much, I took too much and we left a few millions with no work.  Now we blame the evil poor.  If this is all we are, we’re crap and have rendered a section of society sub-human as readily as any clown eugenicist from the 1930’s (we had them too if anyone is thinking Godwin’s Law).

36. How much policing demand is Friday/Saturday/Sunday and drinking-drugging-sports-event related and demands little other than limited skills of presence-physicality-commonsense?  Could this be met by a part-time force and could other areas such as youth gangs also be dealt with by part-timers?  Not specials – this is always brought up and always fails.  There might be much more than cost savings in this approach.  Could we have the resources matched to recidivist housing allocations?

37. Is a lot of policing really “skilled” – if not could we get a lot more done on unskilled wages and a ‘mass production equivalent’ approach through local people who will not be entering a ‘career’ with all the associated costs?

38. What would really “demotivate” our criminals?  If we had proper ‘peace and consideration laws’ and quickly available bodies to stop vile behaviour could we get rid of the criminal family intimidation, street bullies, domestic violence and so on?  Something genuinely local?  Cop books-blogs have it that Swamps, Reservations (Everglades in mine) provide shelter for pond-life crooks and networks to sell stolen goods – yet my experience is that 90% and more want it all stopped and I suspect a ‘containment policy’ that does just enough to do just that.  Parenting is a key factor, yet why is our education so dumb it isn’t taught and yet ‘education’ so vital the rich pay a lot extra to get the ‘real thing’?

39. Teenage pregnancy, sexual diseases, shoplifting, chronic domestic violence, bullying, drugs, booze and so on just keep on and on in the UK.  There is little difference now in attitudes towards violence than when I was a kid in lower sectors.  Kids are often rude, excluded from schools in which there is a lot of bad behaviour.  Public transport is dire when kids are on it.  We only pretend solutions, yet politicians tell us it is being dealt with over and over.  The failures are obvious.  Is all this some ‘cunning plan’ to make the rest of us strive to earn enough to get away from it all?

40.  Could we have a policing plan that demarcated ‘villages’ again and organised communities that actually know each other again with cops living in them – motivated to make them decent places to live, not shit-holes to escape from?

41. Do we have management all wrong?  I suspect this as a management tutor.  The textbooks are vapid and we know they are.  I don’t want scrote families protected by high paid lawyers who live elsewhere, or directors of social services or ACPO posers and do not believe they serve any useful purpose to the general public.  We were supposed to get ‘flat management structures’ – what has happened is the imposition of tall structures with unaccountable clowns behind a mahogany curtain, sending out PCSOs and unqualified staff.  We need to scrap ranks and ‘rank culture’.

42.  Scrap lawyers in favour of law centres staffed by people universities can qualify, and let supermarkets compete on the same basis and pay scales to allow competition.  Get your representative by rote (prosecution too – so the CPS goes).

43.  Local parliaments and scrap Westminster – this is the information age.  Local networked cops on a national basis too?

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13 thoughts on “Questions on Changing Policing

  1. My actual guess MTG, is that the people making these kinds of decisions have very little clue what is really going on, other than that they can sit in position and get paid. The levels of ignorance are so high in this field that many seem to believe Gadget is blowing the whistle. Those who have read extensively on bureaucracy in general would conclude he is only rattling very old and well-known sabres. The books are already written on organisational behaviour – but we can’t teach most people any of them because they never see the world through the eyes of another.

  2. Took me three different visits to actually read and digest your list there!

    All very astutely observed… I’ve only been in and around this industry 18 months and yet I’m already well aware of the majority of what you talk about

  3. “but we can’t teach most people any of them because they never see the world through the eyes of another.”

    Reminds me of my favourite quote from To Kill a Mocking Bird:

    ‘You never really understand a person until you consider things from his point of view–until you climb inside of his skin and walk around in it.’

    I think most people could learn a lesson in empathy.

  4. I particulary liked the comments that Police wages are ‘theft’ and we need to attract ‘decent’ people into the ranks…

    lol

    My wages are calulated not on what I do, but what I am EXPECTED to do, you know, risk my life for people. Tackle armed offenders when I am not armed myself, that kind of thing.

    As to decent, I wonder how many teachers and lecturers over the years have been done for sexual assault against children? V Police?

    Just another kind of trolling… just a bit more educated.

  5. That is some list! Haven’t done more than just skim it, but didn’t see anything that struck me as odd or pouintless.

    “5. All issues seem to be dealt with by people who are not likely to be victims and live professional lives well away from the problems, yet supported by salaries dependant on the problems.”

    Would elected police chiefs resolve this?

  6. I wouldn’t expect any resolution to this kind of ‘questioning’. The real point is that we aren’t open to genuine questioning in our public dialogue and are being confined to very limited solutions.

    Shijuro asks an important question on whether cops or teachers-academics have had a bigger impact as child abusers over the years. Having been a cop and academic I know I worked with some in both jobs (I actually replaced one in my first teaching post – he was later to get 5 years).

    Pretty obviously Julia, our elected ‘representatives’ seem no answer to anything. I don’t seriously believe giving anyone a job that allows them to live in a ‘protected zone’ and buy a villa in Spain is likely to produce the goods, elected or otherwise. The original Greek Democracy was a total failure and ours seems much the same. Elected police chief models exist and seem a failure (‘The Wire’?). The question might be ‘what problem is it that makes us come up with elected police chiefs as an answer to – especially as this already appears to be failed practice’? If we could get to the real issue, we might find a real solution.

  7. On Paul’s ‘To Kill A Mocking Bird’ I agree – but I’m concerned we have lost the thrust of this type of literature.

    Shij is a bit defensive on police wages as theft. Too complex to get into the systems theory needed here, but our squaddies get much less pay and are exposed to more danger. I agree, of course, we don’t equip our cops properly and actually believe we are traumatising many good people in the job as surely as a bunch of marines on Ambien in Iraq. It’s about to get worse as we enter into cuts made by the self-interested top brass. Gadget’s ‘love affair’ with Ms Home Sec. is misplaced. ConDemn’s interests in cutting red tape and ZanyPFNulabour farce are not the ones we share about getting rid of ‘HRM-pussies’ – there will be a tougher version of ‘Poisonnel’ to replace that. We are frankly too dumb to see the obvious coming.

  8. Yes they are exposed to danger. But this is a time of war… Most of them probably haven’t been near an angry man in their career until being posted abroad… Whereas Police tend to be up against it 24/7.

    Did you know the SAS train with Police SO19? Why? Because SO19 are pulling their guns on a daily basis and there is no substitute for combat experience.

    Here are a few of my experiences… If you think I am overpaid I challenge you to join up…

    1.Knives, Paras and drunk on duty.

    Standing in a kitchen xmas day with an slightly drunk ex-2 para armed with a knife that knew his wife was going to leave him is a potential for super stress. My partner was helping to shoo the kids into the car and he was telling me he was going to ‘talk’ to her-regardless of me. After him shouting at me for a minute or two he walked towards me slowly with the knife. I took a ready stance and he said ‘oh right done a bit have you? Well I know more…’ I stood my ground and said, ‘look… We are both grown men and grown men deal with problems by talking not fighting.’ He put down the knife and asked me if I wanted a drink. Two large glasses of scotch later he was in tears telling me how much he loved his missus and kids.

    But for a moment… I thought I was a gonner… My sarge insisted I sit in his office and tell me all with a LARGE mug of black coffee, great sarge.

    2. The six death messages in a night.

    After attending a 15-story high jumper, helping put what was left of him into a bag (the probationer undertaker was being sick poor chap) myself and another officer went to 6-houses to tell his large family. Reaction was diverse: disbelief to anger to crying.

    The worst one was the 1st one, mum and dad. We got them up at 0200hrs and waited in the kitchen with mum while dad got himself ready. She sat their in silence, her eyes locked to mine not knowing which of her family was dead.

    When I got home I was actually on leave for a week and I slept for about 12-hours.

    3. Big blues and twos..,

    We were on the response car on the other side of the sub-div when we get a call that an 8-year old has been run over outside a school,poss deceased, lots of unhappy parents and children there but no ambo. It’s school rush hour and we blue and two’d it all the way… Time stood still. It only took 5 or 6 mins, felt like an hour.

    She was ok, broken arm and bruised but ok. Driver in shock. My radio message became local legend, ‘Mike 22, the reports of her death were greatly exaggerated…’

    That drive through the uncaring traffic was hyper stress.

    4. Double murder scene.

    Mum and 8-year old daughter. Murdered. The scene was bad enough not as bad as the post mortems though.

    5. Burley brawl.

    Massive pub fight. I ended up being strangled to the point of passing out. I was rescued by my gaffer… He dragged the bloke off me. Not arrested. No court for him.

    6. Ouch!

    Fight in a cell, it was a draw. My rotator cuff ripped, I felt it go…

    Thought my career was over. Sadly it wasn’t.

    There are more.., but I hate typing on my iPhone

  9. Shijuro – these are the kinds of situations I remember – I did my whack. I also noticed there were some officers who were never around when these situations took place. We oldies also worked with less back-up and more often on our own and with much less equipment. You are, in a sense, both making and missing the point. Why does so much salary go to those not generally exposed?
    Heavy industry and construction were always more dangerous than policing. Response was always more dangerous than most of the rest of policing – even being on shifts is more dangerous than 9 – 5. this is not reflected in pay.

    The arguments here range from under-paid Response through to highly overpaid ‘ACPO thieves’ and on to why some of the public sector is not treated the same as other industry in terms of competition and wage depression.

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